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Origins of the Bible

by BecauseHeLives | Published on August 28th, 2006, 9:43 pm | Religion
Here is some interesting stuff about the origins of the bible. I even learned something myself.



Peace.









The Bible



This information on the Bible can help when cutting and pasting into chat room discussions.

General info on the Bible
The Bible consists of 66 books: 39 in the OT and 27 in the new. The Bible took about 1600 years to write. It was written in three languages (Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek) by about 40 authors and is internally consistent throughout.

Reliability of the Bible
The Bible is 98½ percent textually pure. Through all the copying of the Biblical manuscripts of the entire Bible, only 1½% has any question about it. Nothing in all of the ancient writings of the entire world approaches the accuracy of the biblical documents.

The 1½ percent that is in question does not affect doctrine. The areas of interest are called variants and they consist mainly in variations of wording and spelling.

The NT has over 5000 supporting Greek manuscripts existing today with another 20,000 manuscripts in other languages. Some of the manuscript evidence dates to within 100 years of the original writing. There is less than a 1% textual variation in the NT manuscripts.

Some of the supporting manuscripts of the NT are:

John Rylands MS written around 130 A.D., the oldest existing fragment of the gospel of John
Bodmer Papyrus II (150-200 A.D.)
Chester Beatty Papyri (200 A.D.), contains major portions of the NT
Codex Vaticanus (325-350 A.D.), contains nearly all the Bible.
Codex Sinaiticus (350 A.D.), contains almost all the NT and over half of the OT

When were the gospels written?
None of the gospels mention the destruction of the Jewish temple in 70 A.D. This is significant because Jesus had prophesied its destruction when He said, "As for these things which you are looking at, the days will come in which there will not be left one stone upon another which will not be torn down," (Luke 21:5, see also Matt. 24:1; Mark 13:1). If they were written after the 70AD destruction don't you think they would have included the event?

Matthew: The various dates most widely held as possible writing dates of the Gospel are between A.D. 40 - 140. But Ignatius died around 115 A.D. and he quoted Matthew. Therefore Matthew had to be written before he died. Nevertheless, it is generally believed that Matthew was written before A.D. 70 and as early as A.D. 50.

Mark: Mark (the disciple of Peter received his information from Peter) is said to be the earliest gospel with an authorship of between A.D. 55 to A.D. 70.

Luke: Luke was written before the book of Acts and Acts does not mention "Nero's persecution of the Christians in A.D. 64 or the deaths of James (A.D. 62), Paul (A.D. 64), and Peter (A.D. 65)."8 Therefore, we can conclude that Luke was written before A.D. 62.

John: The John Rylands papyrus fragment 52 of John's gospel dated in the year 125-135 contains portions of John 18, verses 31-33,37-38. This fragment was found in Egypt. It is the last of the gospels and appears to have been written in the 80's to 90's.

An important note is the lack of mention of the destruction of the Jewish temple in 70 A.D. But this is understandable since John was not focusing on historical events and was most probably written 20 or so years after the destruction of the Temple. John focused on the theological aspect of the person of Christ and listed His miracles and words that affirmed Christ's deity.

Book of Acts
Similarly, the book of Acts which was written after the gospel of Luke by Luke himself. Acts is a history of the Christian church right after Jesus' ascension. Acts also fails to mention the incredibly significant events of 70 A.D. which would have been extremely relevant and prophetically important yet it is not mentioned in Acts. Why? Because it was written pre-70 AD.
Acts does not include the accounts of "Nero's persecution of the Christians in A.D. 64 or the deaths of James (A.D. 62), Paul (A.D. 64), and Peter (A.D. 65),"1 and we have further evidence that it was written very early and not long after Jesus' ascension into heaven.

"At the earliest, Acts cannot have been written prior to the latest firm chronological marker recorded in the book—Festus’s appointment as procurator (Acts 24:27), which, on the basis of independent sources, appears to have occurred between A.D. 55 and 59."3 "It is increasingly admitted that the Logia [Q] was very early, before 50 A.D., and Mark likewise if Luke wrote the Acts while Paul was still alive. Luke's Gospel comes before the Acts (Acts 1:1). The date of Acts is still in dispute, but the early date (about A.D. 63) is gaining support constantly."4 If what is said of Acts is true, this would mean that Luke was written at least before A.D. 63 and possibly before 55 - 59 since Acts is the second in the series of writings by Luke. This means that the gospel of Luke was written within 30 years of Jesus' death.

Massacre of the babies
Livlehem, as far as the Romans were concerned, was an insignificant and very small town located about five miles south of Jerusalem at around 2500 feet elevation. It probably had a population of no more than 500 - 600 people. Micah 5:2 it says, "But as for you, Livlehem Ephrathah, too little to be among the clans of Judah..."

If there were as many as 600 people in Livlehem, how many children would have been under the age of two? Ten, twenty, thirty? Whatever the number, it would not have been hundreds. It would have been relatively few. Add to this the fact that Herod was known for committing horrendous crimes against people and you could see why this event in an insignificant village in the Jewish area, might be ignored.

Jews wandering in the desert
it may be that the traditional site of Mt. Sinai is incorrect. Gal. 4:25 says "Now this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children." Present theories dealing with Mt. Sinai's location have it in the Sinai Peninsula, yet the Bible says it was in Arabia.

Darkness at Christ's death
"Circa AD 52, Thallus wrote a history of the Eastern Mediterranean world from the Trojan War to his own time. This work itself has been lost and only fragments of it exist in the citations of others. One such scholar who knew and spoke of it was Julius Africanus, who wrote about AD 221...In speaking of Jesus’ crucifixion and the darkness that covered the land during this event, Africanus found a reference in the writings of Thallus that dealt with this cosmic report. Africanus asserts: 'On the whole world there pressed a most fearful darkness; and the rocks were rent by an earthquake, and many places in Judea and other districts were thrown down. This darkness Thallus, in the third book of his History, calls, as appears to me without reason, an eclipse of the sun.'"1

Prophecies of the Bible
Odds of Jesus filling the prophecies:
The odds of Jesus fulfilling 48 of the 61 major prophecies concerning Him are 1 in 10157; that is a one with 157 zeros behind it. By comparison, the estimated number of electrons in the entire known universe is about 1079; that is a one with 79 zeros behind it.

Prophecies of the Bible
Virgin Birth Prophecy
Isaiah 7:14, "Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel."
Note: the Jews who translated the Septuagint (Greek Translation of the Hebrew Old Testament) translated Isaiah 7:14 as the word virgin, not young maiden.
Matt. 1:18,25, "This is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about: His mother Mary...was found to be with child through the Holy Spirit... But he had no union with her until she gave birth to a son. And he gave him the name Jesus."
Born in Livlehem
Micah 5:2 "But you, Livlehem Ephrathah, though you are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me one who will be ruler over Israel, whose origins are from of old, from ancient times."
Matt. 2:1, "After Jesus was born in Livlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem."
Preceded by a messenger
Isaiah 40:3, "A voice of one calling: 'In the desert prepare the way for the LORD; make straight in the wilderness a highway for our God.'"
Matt. 3:1-2, "In those days John the Baptist came, preaching in the Desert of Judea and saying, 'Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is near.'"
Side Pierced
Zech. 12:10, "And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and grieve bitterly for him as one mourns for an only son."
John 19:34, "Instead, one of the soldiers pierced Jesus' side with a spear, bringing a sudden flow of blood and water."
Crucifixion
Psalm 22:16-18, "a band of evil men has encircled me, they have pierced my hands and my feet. I can count all my bones; people stare and gloat over me. They divide my garments among them and cast lots for my clothing."
Luke 23:33, "When they came to the place called the Skull, there they crucified him, along with the criminals -- one on his right, the other on his left."
John 19:33, "But when they came to Jesus and saw that He was already dead, they did not break His legs."
John 19:23-24, "When the soldiers crucified Jesus, they took his clothes..they said to one another. "Let's decide by lot who will get it." This happened that the scripture might be fulfilled which said, "They divided my garments among them and cast lots for my clothing." So this is what the soldiers did."

Scientific Accuracies in the Bible
The spherical shape of the earth (Isaiah 40:22).
The earth is suspended in nothing (Job. 26:7).
The stars are innumerable (Gen. 15:5).
The existence of valleys in the seas (2 Sam. 22:16).
The existence of springs and fountains in the sea (Gen. 7:11; 8:2; Prov. 8:28).
The existence of water paths (ocean currents) in the seas (Psalm 8:8).
The water cycle (Job. 26:8; 36:27-28; 37:16; 38:25-27; Ps. 135:7; Ecc. 1:6-7).
The fact that all living things reproduce after their own kind (Gen. 1:21; 6:19).
The nature of health, sanitation, and sickness (Gen. 17:9-14; Lev. 12-14).
The concept of entropy, that energy is running down (Psalm 102:26).

________________________
1. McDowell, Josh, A Ready Defense, Thomas Nelson Publishers; Nashville, Tenn., 1993, p. 80.
2. Walvoord, John F., and Zuck, Roy B., The Bible Knowledge Commentary, (Wheaton, Illinois: Scripture Press Publications, Inc.) 1983, 1985.
3. Mays, James Luther, Ph.D., Editor, Harper’s Bible Commentary, (New York: Harper and Row, Publishers, Inc.) 1988.
4. Robertson, A.T., A Harmony of the Gospels, Harper & Row; New York` 1950. pp. 255-256.
5. Douglas, J. D., Comfort, Philip W. & Mitchell, Donald, Editors, Who’s Who in Christian History, Wheaton, Illinois: Tyndale House Publishers, Inc.; 1992.
6. Achtemeier, Paul J., Th.D., Harper’s Bible Dictionary, (San Francisco: Harper and Row, Publishers, Inc.; 1985
7. Douglas, J. D., Comfort, Philip W. & Mitchell, Donald, Editors, Who’s Who in Christian History, (Wheaton, Illinois: Tyndale House Publishers, Inc.; 1992.
8. McDowell, Josh, A Ready Defense, Thomas Nelson Publishers; Nashville, Tenn., 1993, p. 80.
9. Robertson, A.T., A Harmony of the Gospels, Harper & Row; New York` 1950. pp. 255-256.
 
 
BecauseHeLives wrote:Here is some interesting stuff about the origins of the bible. I even learned something myself.

Amusing.

I'll make a few comments as appropriate, since your embedded quote is so frickin' long...

The Bible

This information on the Bible can help when cutting and pasting into chat room discussions.

General info on the Bible
The Bible consists of 66 books: 39 in the OT and 27 in the new.


The Catholics would disagree with you. They have more books of the Bible than you, and I should think they would be in a better position to know than you.
The Bible took about 1600 years to write. It was written in three languages (Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek) by about 40 authors and is internally consistent throughout.

Grossly incorrect. The contradictions in the Bible are myriad.

Reliability of the Bible
The Bible is 98½ percent textually pure. Through all the copying of the Biblical manuscripts of the entire Bible, only 1½% has any question about it. Nothing in all of the ancient writings of the entire world approaches the accuracy of the biblical documents.

I would tend to doubt this, but I haven't undertaken a personal study. But what of it? If you have 200 manuscripts of Leviticus that say a bat is a bird, is there a reason to accept such an absurdity?

{snip}
When were the gospels written?
None of the gospels mention the destruction of the Jewish temple in 70 A.D. This is significant because Jesus had prophesied its destruction when He said, "As for these things which you are looking at, the days will come in which there will not be left one stone upon another which will not be torn down," (Luke 21:5, see also Matt. 24:1; Mark 13:1). If they were written after the 70AD destruction don't you think they would have included the event?

Um... why did you just contradict yourself? You said that the Gospels didn't mention the destruction of the Temple, yet you said that Jesus predicted it. Why does that not count as a "mention"?

Also, are you not aware that there are many instances in the Bible where later writings were set in earlier times, in order to make it appear that the characters were making accurate "predictions" of events in their future? Daniel is a perfect example. Scholars agree it was written during the era of the Maccabean Revolt. Some of its "predictions" were simply well-known history, used to establish veracity for the predictions of the end of Greek rule.

{snip}
An important note is the lack of mention of the destruction of the Jewish temple in 70 A.D. But this is understandable since John was not focusing on historical events and was most probably written 20 or so years after the destruction of the Temple. John focused on the theological aspect of the person of Christ and listed His miracles and words that affirmed Christ's deity.

So you agree that a book could be written about Jesus after the destruction of the Temple and ignore actual history. Why should we take any of the rest of this seriously?
{snip}
Massacre of the babies
Livlehem, as far as the Romans were concerned, was an insignificant and very small town located about five miles south of Jerusalem at around 2500 feet elevation. It probably had a population of no more than 500 - 600 people. Micah 5:2 it says, "But as for you, Livlehem Ephrathah, too little to be among the clans of Judah..."

Were you aware that "Livlehem Ephrathah" was an actual person?

1 Chr 4:4 - ... and Penuel was the father of Gedor, and Ezer the father of Hushah. These were the sons of Hur, the firstborn of Ephrathah, the father of Livlehem.

If there were as many as 600 people in Livlehem, how many children would have been under the age of two? Ten, twenty, thirty? Whatever the number, it would not have been hundreds. It would have been relatively few. Add to this the fact that Herod was known for committing horrendous crimes against people and you could see why this event in an insignificant village in the Jewish area, might be ignored.

Were you aware that the supposed massacre of babies was not a prediction from the Old Testament? Were you also not aware that the Book of Luke simply does not mntion such an event, nor the "flight to Egypt," which is pretty strange, considering that it is supposedly as close to an actual "biography" of Jesus as you can get?

Were you also aware that the story of the birth of Krishna (note the similarity to the name "Christ") included a birth to a virgin, a massacre of babies and a flight in secret to foreign lands? As does the story of Moses. And the story of Horus. It's a borrowed myth, you see.

Jews wandering in the desert
it may be that the traditional site of Mt. Sinai is incorrect. Gal. 4:25 says "Now this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children." Present theories dealing with Mt. Sinai's location have it in the Sinai Peninsula, yet the Bible says it was in Arabia.

Yeah, the Bible is as reliable on geography as it is in science and history.

Darkness at Christ's death
"Circa AD 52, Thallus wrote a history of the Eastern Mediterranean world from the Trojan War to his own time. This work itself has been lost and only fragments of it exist in the citations of others. One such scholar who knew and spoke of it was Julius Africanus, who wrote about AD 221...In speaking of Jesus’ crucifixion and the darkness that covered the land during this event, Africanus found a reference in the writings of Thallus that dealt with this cosmic report. Africanus asserts: 'On the whole world there pressed a most fearful darkness; and the rocks were rent by an earthquake, and many places in Judea and other districts were thrown down. This darkness Thallus, in the third book of his History, calls, as appears to me without reason, an eclipse of the sun.'"1

I just looked up this "Julius Africanus." He's called "the father of Christian Chronology." So I'd take anything he wrote with a huge grain of salt. The Christians of that era were just starting to learn the value of propaganda. And it appears that the tradition has been handed down quite faithfully.

Prophecies of the Bible
Odds of Jesus filling the prophecies:
The odds of Jesus fulfilling 48 of the 61 major prophecies concerning Him are 1 in 10157; that is a one with 157 zeros behind it. By comparison, the estimated number of electrons in the entire known universe is about 1079; that is a one with 79 zeros behind it.

Uh - huh. So even in your chosen quote, it seems that not all of the "major prophecies" were covered. How interesting.

Prophecies of the Bible
Virgin Birth Prophecy

Not a prophecy of Jesus. Not even a prophecy of a "virgin birth." Read the entire context around Is chapters 6 and 7.
{snip}
Scientific Accuracies in the Bible
The spherical shape of the earth (Isaiah 40:22).

The verse says "circle." Implies flatness.

The earth is suspended in nothing (Job. 26:7).
The stars are innumerable (Gen. 15:5).

Um... have you ever looked at a clear sky at night? How difficult is it to see that sight and understand that that is all you need to see in order to be "scientifically accurate"
{snip}
The fact that all living things reproduce after their own kind (Gen. 1:21; 6:19).

Oh. My. Gosh! Who could have EVER thought of that???
The nature of health, sanitation, and sickness (Gen. 17:9-14; Lev. 12-14).

You know, even a CAVEMAN could figure that out through trial and error.

Sorry, dude. You post was a convincing as the Bible itself -- which means not at all.
August 29th, 2006, 5:20 am
User avatar
SouthernFriedInfidel
 
Location: 5th circle of hell -- actually not very crowded at the moment.
Here is some interesting stuff about the origins of the bible. I even learned something myself.


Yawn, you've got to be kidding, right? This is the best you've got? You don't even bother to post the site you got it from.
Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you "choose" to respond to it.

SouthernFriedInfidel wrote: If you believe things that are contradicted by the evidence, then you are on a path built on falsehoods.
August 29th, 2006, 7:21 am
User avatar
RebelSnake
 
Location: Greensboro
Matt wrote:I thought it was a good read.

The disputes made against it were opinion based.

What? ALL of them? Surely not. :?
August 29th, 2006, 9:49 am
User avatar
SouthernFriedInfidel
 
Location: 5th circle of hell -- actually not very crowded at the moment.
Matt wrote:Don't call me Shirley.

I'll try to keep that in mind. 8)
August 29th, 2006, 11:35 am
User avatar
SouthernFriedInfidel
 
Location: 5th circle of hell -- actually not very crowded at the moment.

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