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Greensboro Triumph Center

by Knightrider | Published on May 3rd, 2007, 4:55 am | Greensboro
The cat is finally out of the bag! A developer is looking at several sites in downtown Greensboro that would be the largest complex the center-city has ever seen! The complex would include a high-rise hotel, restaurants, entertainment venues, residential, office and retail space. some of the sites being considered are

1 directly next to First Horizon Ballpark behind left field

2 the large Duke Power site next to the Children's Museum

3 a site between Market and Friendly Streets

apparently this is a MAJOR project because the unnamed out of town developer is looking at a few other cities so this is not a done deal but based on the size and scope of this project, we could see more than one high-rise in this project. This would be a HUGE DEAL for downtown Greensboro. The entertainment venues could turn out being venues such as "The house of Blues" since this project is being considered for other cites.


Whisper of major project stirs city

GREENSBORO — An out-of-town development company is considering four sites downtown for an entertainment, shopping and residential complex that could be the largest ever in the center city.

The project, which is still in the discussion phase, could cost at least $50 million and top out at $150 million.

The development could include restaurants and entertainment venues; residential, office and retail space; and a high-rise hotel.

City officials and downtown leaders have been tight-lipped about the project because it could wind up in another city; the developer is said to be considering sites between Virginia and Florida.

"It's so early," said Ray Gibbs, president of Downtown Greensboro Inc. "It upsets me when people start talking about ... something that is extremely conceptual. We don't want to comment because it is so conceptual."

The developer has not been identified.

A decision could be made on the project within six months. It would then take a year to put the plans together.

So far, the developer has been shown six sites downtown. That list has been narrowed to four, only two of which have been identified:

* the Weaver Foundation property at Church Street and Friendly Avenue, plus land across Friendly owned by the city and Lincoln National Corp.;

* the former Bellemeade Village property next to First Horizon Park.

Some property owners apparently are unaware that their land is being considered.

"No one has been in contact with us," said Skip Moore, president of the Weaver Foundation, which owns the former Duke Power property at Church and Friendly. "If they want to build on our property, it is pretty early."

Efforts to reach Jim and Steve Jones, who own the 6-acre Bellemeade Village tract, were unsuccessful.

City officials have had little comment.

"All I can say is that there has been some interest in those areas," said City Manager Mitchell Johnson, referring to the Weaver property and the land across Friendly. "It is very exciting when you think about what the potential is for that area."

Johnson said he and a committee of area stakeholders had already been putting together a development plan for the downtown cultural district, an area that includes the city, Lincoln and Weaver properties.

The parcels cover about 8 acres.

Because of the project's scope, sources say, it would likely require some public money to make it work. Those incentives would primarily come in the form of improvements such as a parking deck, sidewalks and streets.

Sources say it is too early to know the amount of an incentive request.

They say no plans have been drawn or buildings designed. There's also no word on how many rooms the hotel might have or how tall it might be.

Those familiar with the project say the developer must decide if the project will work in Greensboro and specifically downtown.

"The project here is one that I think can be extremely exciting," Gibbs said. "(But) it's extremely early .... It's like the first mile of a marathon. We are at the easy mile."

Multimillion dollar projects are becoming more frequent downtown.

Developer Roy Carroll is moving ahead with a $37 million rehab of the former Wachovia building on North Elm Street.

And developer John Kavanagh and Brown Investment Properties plan to spend $42 million on a housing, office and retail project in an area bounded by Summit Avenue, Lindsay Street and Murrow Boulevard.
 
 
OH MAN! That would rock. I guess I had better purchase my downtown townhome now. LOL

Side note, Knightrider.. there seems to be code for an avatat next to your name but nothing appears. Why is that? I noticed it on PCs at two locations. so it isnt blocked on my end.
"You can't put the civil rights of a minority up for a majority vote."
May 3rd, 2007, 8:18 am
User avatar
Sanjuro
Expert...on everything...
 
I dont have an avatar but I guess Ishould get one :)


I've been thinking.....since other cities are being considered for this, it leads me to believe that this could be some kind of "themed" urban development that could be designed to attract tourists which combines residential and office. Entertainment seems to be a big part of the project and "Florida" was mentioned as a site. It wouldnt make sense for this "development company" to scout for cities throughout the south for merely a hotel/residential development.......ummmmm I wonder. Could this project be much bigger in nature than we realize? The "development company" appears to be showing HIGH interest in downtown Greensboro because its narrowed down sites. I have a few ideas running around in my head what this could really be because I dont think we've been told the whole story yet. I wont mentioned them but and if im correct, this is HUGE for not just downtown but for Greensboro and would REALLY help increase downtown develpment.

Greensboro may be the front runner because I have not heard anything like this mentioned on news media from other southern cities. I just have a strange feeling this is really going to be a HUGE project, and not just in physical size. The paper said "The development company has to decide wether this will work in Greensboro", not just downtown. That tells me its not just a hotel and condos. This gives us a hint what the city could be dealing with here.
May 3rd, 2007, 9:07 am
User avatar
Knightrider
 
Location: Downtown Greensboro
One word... IMAX


Re: Avatar.. Here is what I see when I go to the properties of the "X" box next to your name:

http://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/uploads/av-41.jpg
May 3rd, 2007, 9:10 am
User avatar
Sanjuro
Expert...on everything...
 
Something else that occurred to me. NC doesn't have a Hard Rock Cafe.

But there would need to be something there that would warrant filling a hotel. Hmmm... I don't think even a House of Blues would do that.

Giant Aquarium? But there is one in Atlanta.
May 3rd, 2007, 9:48 am
User avatar
Sanjuro
Expert...on everything...
 
nothing loads when I click on the link.

OK FUNNY LOL! All of sudden I have an avatar.
May 3rd, 2007, 9:54 am
User avatar
Knightrider
 
Location: Downtown Greensboro
Sanjuro wrote:Something else that occurred to me. NC doesn't have a Hard Rock Cafe.

We have Rockola. Isn't that close enough for our uses? :lol:
May 3rd, 2007, 11:33 am
User avatar
SouthernFriedInfidel
 
Location: 5th circle of hell -- actually not very crowded at the moment.
Liv wrote:KnightRider has been secretly and covertly been spying on the future of Downtown Greensboro for us.

I'll be entirely too old to enjoy any of it by the time it comes to be. I DON'T HAVE 45 YEARS TO WAIT!!! It'll take that long and a couple of billions to make Greensboro interesting enough for my liking.
:arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :!:
May 3rd, 2007, 11:36 am
User avatar
SouthernFriedInfidel
 
Location: 5th circle of hell -- actually not very crowded at the moment.
Rockola sucks now.... 15 years ago it was AWESOME! Their Tacos were out of this world, and their fries, scrumtious!... Now... It's so "upscale" and sucky.
May 3rd, 2007, 11:44 am
User avatar
Liv
I show you something fantastic and you find fault.
 
Location: Greensboro, NC
Liv wrote:Rockola sucks now.... 15 years ago it was AWESOME! Their Tacos were out of this world, and their fries, scrumtious!... Now... It's so "upscale" and sucky.

Which makes it a good substitute for Hard Rock. :twisted:
May 3rd, 2007, 11:54 am
User avatar
SouthernFriedInfidel
 
Location: 5th circle of hell -- actually not very crowded at the moment.
I suspect a Hard Rock is going to be difficult for us to ever get unless we get an amusement park... but a good sign of progress would be if we could secure some of the major chains like Jack in the box... ect... We couldn't even keep Miami Subs and they're all over Raleigh, Charlotte, & Fayetteville.
May 3rd, 2007, 12:15 pm
User avatar
Liv
I show you something fantastic and you find fault.
 
Location: Greensboro, NC
Liv wrote:I suspect a Hard Rock is going to be difficult for us to ever get unless we get an amusement park... but a good sign of progress would be if we could secure some of the major chains like Jack in the box... ect... We couldn't even keep Miami Subs and they're all over Raleigh, Charlotte, & Fayetteville.

Oh -- you want a Hard Rock in GREENSBORO? ROTFLMAO!
May 3rd, 2007, 12:20 pm
User avatar
SouthernFriedInfidel
 
Location: 5th circle of hell -- actually not very crowded at the moment.
But the almighty DAUGHTRY (SP?) is from G'boro.
May 3rd, 2007, 12:35 pm
User avatar
Sanjuro
Expert...on everything...
 
I think its a "Downtown Disney District" the developer is from Florida and I do know that Disney is talking about building themed urban center districts in downtowns which will have a local character and not like a Disney World thats been transplanted to another city. Apparently Greenville, SC is competing for this project too. It would take a nice sized tourist attraction to attract another big highrise hotel to downtown Greensboro so this deal is bigger than most people are aware of.
May 3rd, 2007, 3:10 pm
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Knightrider
 
Location: Downtown Greensboro
So will we be renaming West Market street Mickey & Pals Street?
May 3rd, 2007, 4:36 pm
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Liv
I show you something fantastic and you find fault.
 
Location: Greensboro, NC
Hard Rock lasted 2 years in Austin right in the middle of downtown. It went breasts up after a movement of antiestablishmentarianismationology swept through the city. This was a great relief because it was a ridiculous eye sore in a sea of local business. maybe if its the only attraction for entertainment in the downtown area, gbro might have a reasonable relationship with Hard Rock...

Its so nice to see this available on the internets for an old Gtown native. Look forward to contributing!
May 3rd, 2007, 10:57 pm
slidebud
 
WOW THIS NEWS JUST KEEPS GETTING BIGGER AND BIGGER. The developer could also include an unexpected bonus in this project and that is The ACC HALL OF CHAMPIONS & MUSEUM

http://www.news-record.com/apps/pbcs.dl ... 1/70504001
May 4th, 2007, 5:51 am
User avatar
Knightrider
 
Location: Downtown Greensboro
slidebud wrote:Its so nice to see this available on the internets for an old Gtown native. Look forward to contributing!

Yeah, this is a pretty fun place with some very nice, entertaining regulars. Hope you enjoy hanging out for a while. :wink:
May 4th, 2007, 6:58 am
User avatar
SouthernFriedInfidel
 
Location: 5th circle of hell -- actually not very crowded at the moment.
I was let in on a few things from a source but I still dont know what this project is. I will say that this development is larger than anyone can imagine and the the media is far from know the details of this potential massive project. A few thing I wont say here because I dont want to reveal to much here but according to a source, there are 3 diferent possible plans for this project and the smallest scaled down version is about the size of Charlotte's future EpiCentre project which is an entertainment complex that features a 50-story tower along with a bowling alley, themed restaurants like ESPN Zone and a hotel. From what I am hearing the largest plan of this potential development would be larger than EpiCentre and Peabody Place (in Memphis) combined. I heard that the largest plan would turn Greensboro into a "destination city" The reason these Florida developers are looking at Greensboro, has to do with the city's history and its location between two other major markets (Charlotte and Raleigh) so the development is obviously counting on a statewide draw.
May 5th, 2007, 9:22 am
User avatar
Knightrider
 
Location: Downtown Greensboro
I think Geography-wise it's absolutely stupid nothing "amazing" has happened here prior to this. With Greensboro being on I-40, the geographic center of the state. The absolute mid-point between FL and NY, and a lackluster economy with too much money and wealthy families just waiting to be tapped into.
May 5th, 2007, 11:20 am
User avatar
Liv
I show you something fantastic and you find fault.
 
Location: Greensboro, NC
Liv wrote:I think Geography-wise it's absolutely stupid nothing "amazing" has happened here prior to this. With Greensboro being on I-40, the geographic center of the state. The absolute mid-point between FL and NY, and a lackluster economy with too much money and wealthy families just waiting to be tapped into.


I know..its like all of a sudden people are saying ahhhhh Greensboro is in the perfect location
May 7th, 2007, 11:35 am
User avatar
Knightrider
 
Location: Downtown Greensboro
Knightrider wrote:I know..its like all of a sudden people are saying ahhhhh Greensboro is in the perfect location


Yes, Greensboro is the perfect location because of it's central location, but...

1. Our city government is a joke
2. Our police department is a joke
3. Our county government is a joke
4. People from Raleigh do not go to Greensboro
5. People from Charlotte do not go to Greensboro
6. We can't sustain low-level minor league teams
7. We can't draw marquee names (consistently) to our Coliseum
8. Our Coliseum is a joke

Don't get me wrong, I really like Greensboro and have lived here for 16+ years and just bought a condo downtown (as an investment).

But, we'll never be big time. For crying out loud, people think Joey Medaloni (not his real name, BTW), is big time. That is the biggest joke of all!!!
May 7th, 2007, 12:49 pm
User avatar
rumface
 
Location: Triad Area
I've thought deep and hard about it, and I've mentioned before that in order for a city to be "great" it's got to be known for something. For example:

LA: Movies, Hollywood, etc.
Philadelphia: Cheesesteak, Rocky, Sesame Street
Chicago: Pizza?
Detroit: Cars
Seattle: Tech
Atlanta: Black people & the Braves
Miami: Cuban Gay People & Old Folks


It doesn't even have to be a big city, or a big thing. Take for instance the city of Punxsutawney. Population 7000.... but, you instantly know about the city because of Ground Hog Day and Punxsutawney Phil.

Greensboro for the longest time was known as the city on the back of the Newport box, but as less people smoke, and that industry fades, Greensboro has little or no global footprint. I realize this day in and day out when I talk to people everywhere and often get asked "And where are you."

Greensboro needs to define itself. It needs to clearly define its goal as a city and as a community. You can't complain when the "Kids" call it greensboring, if you don't want the growth or dont have the kahunas to make the change.

If we were really willing to "go down that road", it would involve a very large amount of money, a large amount of land, and a commitment to innovation not renovation. Competing with other cities on similar projects seem silly, and ultimately beside the point. Businesses, and projects, like the ACC should want to choose Greensboro, not convinced or paid to do so. (or even worst have a concert put on to attract them.) To do so, we need something bigger, something larger. It won't be a professional sports team, or skyscrapers or Chris Daughtry...

The minimum requirement for a innovative project would be something large enough to draw traffic from atleast 10-15 states. Become an iconic, national recognizable symbol, and require significant infrastructure, investment, and restructuring of the city's footprint.

There are very few projects that I could think of that would allow Greensboro to become a great city.
The alternative of course is for the city to turn into a burnt out low cost suburban overflow city for Raleigh or even Winston Salem. Together the 2 cities could become the cancer of the state.

I suspect the later of the two options will be the most likely scenario, with you and me are living out our low cost, upper-middle-class lives in a nice city with amenities, and then at some point, it will become a poverty stricken, urban center, with less the important purposes. It's already begun. For anyone who lived here 10 years ago, you'll quickly realize how much homelessness, and vagrant vagabonds, beggars, and poverty has ravished the area. We all ignore it, but it's a sign of metamorphosis. Sadly we look more like a decaying Detroit then a blossoming southern city in it's infancy...

but that's just my 2 cents.
May 7th, 2007, 4:10 pm
User avatar
Liv
I show you something fantastic and you find fault.
 
Location: Greensboro, NC
First, I would think Seattle is known for coffee, not tech. Ever hear of Starbucks? Ever drive more than a mile without seeing one??? :D

Second, I thought Greensboro is internationally known as "Blogsboro"??

http://blog.news-record.com/staff/jrblog/archives/2005/06/todays_newspape_5.html

The sad thing is, that term was coined about 2 years ago and our leaders could have jumped on that and started to transition Greensboro into a "Tech Center". Did they? No. Why? Because they are a joke.

Well Liv, if your definition of a "great" city is people coming to the area from 15 states away, then count us out; we're packing our bags. We lived in NJ close to New York City for 26 years. We moved to Greensboro to get away from all traffic, congestion, tourists, etc. Sure, it was great being 30 minutes from NYC (without traffic), and having top name performers, sports teams, gambling, etc nearby, but the quality of life there sucked.

I totally agree, Greensboro needs to define itself. The problem is, the "kids" are letting the 60+ year olds that run Greensboro define it. Guess what?? That isn't going to work!!! Changing mayors may be a beginning, so long as it's not Yvonne Johnson or anyone else over 50 for that matter. Chris Daughtry for mayor...LOL!!

I don't recall how long you've lived here, but we've been here 16+ years and I'm not seeing a "decaying Detriot". When we moved here, there was NOTHING! Okay, maybe there is still nothing, compared to what there should be. But there is definitely more to do here now than there was 10 years ago.

Sure, the growth hasn't been what it should, but I point back to the leaders. Even with the minimal growth Greensboro has experienced in the last 10 years, you have to expect the "homelessness, and vagrant vagabonds, beggars, and poverty". I agree, it's a problem that needs to be addressed. But I think for a city of our size, it's not a rampant problem, which is why it as been "ignored".

I don't think Greensboro is decaying, but it's certainly not blossoming either. We're just stuck. We need the right balance to maintain an acceptable quality of life, but to also grow by attracting businesses and "tourists". I know this is "duh", but why aren't the leaders doing this? FedEx? HondaJet? Puh-lease!! Let's get Cisco, Oracle, eBay, Amazon, Sun, KPMG, Deloitte, etc here.
May 8th, 2007, 6:53 pm
User avatar
rumface
 
Location: Triad Area
rumface wrote:Well Liv, if your definition of a "great" city is people coming to the area from 15 states away, then count us out; we're packing our bags. We lived in NJ close to New York City for 26 years. We moved to Greensboro to get away from all traffic, congestion, tourists, etc. Sure, it was great being 30 minutes from NYC (without traffic), and having top name performers, sports teams, gambling, etc nearby, but the quality of life there sucked.


I think that's the misconception that's holding us back. Just because we'd grow, and attract outside vistors doesn't mean we're going to turn into NY or LA, or even Atlanta, or Charlotte.... There are many cities with a laid back style of living and an easy go pace, that also offer "big" attractions that are lucrative and appeal to people many miles away. It's all in how you structure it... A downtown... atrraction very well might cause serious disruptions, but a amusement park on the outskirts of town might not,.
May 9th, 2007, 7:38 am
User avatar
Liv
I show you something fantastic and you find fault.
 
Location: Greensboro, NC

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