Thought of the day: Why go to college?

[Liv]

So I've now been back in college for a few years. Most recently, I'm at a four year university, and I'm finding more and more that there's a implied goal of graduating, finding an awesome paying job, and settling down in the suburbs. Except that's not what I want, that's never what I ever wanted. In fact, I'll be perfectly content with finding an opportunity after college to be in the service of others, and be provided a small stipend to live. There's definitely that American point of view, that education equals riches, and elite status. Of course I'm certain that there are others whom believe as I do, but are also silenced by the perpetual hum of the machine. The machine that wants to chew me into educational byproduct, and form me into a functional "exact-fit" component of American capitalism. When I suggest anything otherwise, I get dirty looks, and confused faces.

[A Person]

I'll be perfectly content with finding an opportunity after college to be in the service of others, and be provided a small stipend to live.

That sounds like a "Do you want fries with that" job - and you don't need college for that

Seriously - there are two reasons to go to college: 1) to learn stuff that really interests you; and 2) to learn stuff that will help you get a job that interests you - or at least pays well

[SouthernFriedInfidel]

While my college education was a waste in terms of career preparation, or for learning about the subject that interested me most, I think the liberal arts college model is a valuable part of anyone's educational career. The way the 4-year program is set up, requiring a student to experience a variety of subjects -- languages, history, science and sports -- gives an opportunity to sample the wider world of possibilities available for learning.

What I found most disappointing is that there are no second chances. I got an F in quantum physics, and was forced to move on to some other subject. Perhaps I could have made a better run at the subject if I had remedied my poor grounding in math... but the university had already shunted me off to other realms in favor of students who got it first time.

Such is life. You only get one youth, and I wasted mine. Doesn't mean college is a bad idea. Just means you can get a hell of a lot more out of it, if you're prepared to do the necessary work and look beyond the common attitudes that surround you.

[Liv]

When I say service, I don't mean working at Burger King.

No, I'd like to a part of helping people, just not through a drive-thru.

I'm completely content with working in Africa, digging wells, etc.

I don't aim to be the CEO of a corporate, or land a 100K a year job. Give me a sense of self-worth and enough money to pay the bills.

While I do love being in school, and learning things I both enjoy, and don't enjoy. (Often I'm surprised that I do enjoy the one's I don't too.) - Let's be honest here, the reason I'm in school is to beat the system. To get what I want, by, for awhile, pretending to be a capitalist muncher who dreams of a cushy job, and weekend trips to the beach. Where as, I a) want to get the heck out of dodge, (or at least have the freedom to do so), and b) I'd like to do something to bring fundamental change to the world. I'd rather volunteer than be employed... but those opportunities generally only exist for the elite, or the religiously devoted. Since I'm neither, I must covertly disguise myself in the education system of the upper-middle class and pretend to be like them, until I've acquired the capability to shed my alter-persona and beat them at their own games.

Yes, I'm a bit mental, but it keeps me motivated.

[A Person]

I'd rather volunteer than be employed... but those opportunities generally only exist for the elite, or the religiously devoted

Uh -no.

It's very easy to go overseas on a voluntary program. Students do it all the time

The real problem is that you have dependants and responsibilities. Dump your wife and kids and take off.

It's the velvet handcuffs that you choose to put on that are difficult to remove, not ones installed by 'the system'

Maybe you should have got the 'bum around the world' thing out of your system before taking on the responsibility of a family.

Sorry if that sounds harsh.

[Liv]

No it's true.

I don't doubt that responsibility is certainly a restraint, unique to my situation and others like myself.

That said, almost every opportunity you've described is aimed at youth volunteering. The most popular being The Peace Corps., and is a typically a short-term opportunity, (like others) which again, is usually aimed towards young adults from families that have significant wealth or elite status. Sure there are other opportunities, but likewise, they require a freedom from most all responsibilities. While many people may not have kids, if they're not elite or rich, the may have debts, family responsibilities, or concerns about returning to the US at some point homeless and broke.

I agree it's always possible, but I know many people who have taken up opportunities to serve, and every single one of them comes from a very, very wealthy family. When I was 19 and in college the first time, I was told to move out or start paying rent. I had very little support system in place to do anything, and was ostracised, as was Shannon, into surviving. We did, and we dug ourselves out from Hell, never quite knowing while doing so if we'd eat, or be able to pay bills.

It's not as easy as black and white, and since then, as you can see, I'm fully pursuing the opportunities out there. However to suggest life and all of it's shit and bad decisions don't equate into "the system" seems like wishful thinking to me.

More importantly, having children, are now the facts of life. For me, unlike many men and women who do run off when parental responsibilities diminish opportunities, I'm convinced they are every bit of the change I hope to make in this world as does the deeds and actions in future careers, or volunteer opportunities.

It's the whole package.

[A Person]

I rather think what you're saying is that volunteer work in the 3rd world doesn't pay wery well and only people not concerned about money can to do it.

It tends to attract students since they have no obligations, but I know several retirees who volunteer overseas too, they're neither wealthy nor elite - just that they have no obligations.

In your case, you are concerned about money - and rightly so, since you have people dependant on you, so volunteering jobs helping people who can't pay aren't an option. It's life, not 'the system' which implies something designed or intended to be that way.

[Liv]

If they're retired then, they're by the standards I judge (wink) within an elite class.

Around here, people don't retire, they die.

Being poor = causes debt = (causes children too = ) responsibility.

Unless you run away from it.

I'm not saying there aren't those who manage it. I'm trying to do so as well, and perhaps it won't happen until I shed some responsibilities later in life....

...but...

for most people, around here at least, it's outside of the scope of possibility, regardless of children. At least of those who I have spoken with.

[Feloni S. S. Salt]

I advise against going to college.

I spent at least 10 years in college with 5 or 6 different majors. I love(d) gaining knowledge and conversing with interesting people, and in the 60's one could still work one's way through college, even women, although gender issues made it much more difficult. At U.C. Berkeley, my alma mater, tuition was $100/quarter. I worked nights (full time), had several additional/occasional part-time jobs, and attended classes (full load) during the days. That did little for my social life; I don't remember the names of any of my classmates, or of my instructors/professors...but I remember with relish that few of them were stupid. Stupid people waste one's time unless one's connection with them is primarily emotional.

Today there is no use to put in the incredible energy necessary to attend college. One's classmates WILL be the "elite" (formerly called the nobility in Europe), and many of them WILL be stupid. We had a few like that even at Berkeley in the 60's, so I got a taste of what they were like. Attending college was a way to separate the sheep from the goats, but not a foolproof way, and I suspect it is no longer good even for that.

Did it help me land jobs? Barely, until I went into education, and even then, it was difficult, because autodidacts are an unwelcome embarrassment to faculty members who have no love of learning for its own sake. They claim to educate, when what most of them appear to want is a captive audience.

Today, one can find knowledge (ad infinitum) and interesting conversations on the 'net, even if, like myself, one lives in an area of depleted population (rural). Even if I couldn't access the 'net, I live where encyclopedia sets are given away free, even Britannica! At thrift stores there is a veritable smorgasbord of stimulating reading, because this younger generation is barely literate, and the old folks like myself are dying off! If one wants an education, one should try to snag the interest of a proper old dotard; s/he would probably be better than what I got in most of my classes, due to the superior philosophical perspective of the old and doddering, and the one-on-one free instruction.

Sadly for me, the USA became dysfunctional before I accessed an education for my 3 children. I couldn't afford to give them the stellar college experience that I'd had, because education was no longer enough of a priority for our government to fund. Further, the internet had not yet begun to bloom. Did I feel guilty!

Now I don't feel that way: I have three interesting kids, two of whom are realistically ambitious and doing very well. College wouldn't have done much to help them. In fact, the oldest went to a school where her papers were so good that the profs accused her of plagiarism which infuriated both of us. She was working almost full time, carrying a full load, making better grades than my own honors grades, and was racking up mounds of debt... That's what we attend college for? Being insulted?

If college-age kids work hard, and, college-be-damned, mind their own business, most bosses will love them, and they will have free time.

It's a better way to spend your life.

[Liv]

I'm loving university, and I don't know if it will give me a job, I just merely dislike the atmosphere of trying to be forced into a career path.

Hell, it's not like I don't know what I want... I do, it's just hard to explain it to people.

That said, I definitely think the bar has been set higher for jobs. A BA is an elementary education of the past. MA seems to be the very minimum for a reasonable life these days.

My goal is an MA, but I wouldn't be said if opportunity knocked earlier, or if I went on further in school.