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Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: April 9th, 2010, 1:52 pm
by Liv
chip_and_pin_in_the_us.jpg


Chip and Pin. It sounds like a combination of french fries and needles. Technically it's the way most of Europe pays for things on credit cards. Worse yet, America doesn't have it. Worse yet, getting stuck on the Brussels Metro with one of their stupid unmanned kiosks mocking me telling me to be "Patienze" then telling me my American money is worthless.

See there's a couple things I wish I would have taken with me to Europe. I did good with taking a mobile phone. (check) But I really should have sprung for some boots.... (it's like a national law there) and I wish somehow, someway I could have come up with a chip and pin credit card.

I'll be honest I didn't understand the whole deal completely till Smiler sat me down in the living room of his home and gave me the 411 (118 in the UK :) ) See the U.K, unlike America has signature-less credit and debit cards with microchips that allow the "pin" to sign for the user. While the old magnetic slider cards we have in the U.S. are supposed to still be accepted in the U.K. and mainland Europe, I found that's not always the case... for instance... In Brussels, where the computerized kiosks give you two options, cash or card. My American debit/credit card is useless despite any which way you try to insert it into the slot, (believe me, I got creative) or what foul language you use- so that leaves cash. Except most Americans get their Euros (or Pounds) from the ATM which (I've never seen one that shoots out coins) spews notes that unfortunately don't work in the kiosk. I'm told many self-serve gas stations have left tourists stranded. Fortunately Brussels doesn't really care and you can still walk on to the Metro. We dug up the 1.50€ for a single jump (all we had in our pockets) and prayed one of us didn't get busted by the random checks they do. We made it safe down to Stockel where lovely Sarah helped us out with her chip and pin card.

I will admit I was aware of this before I went. I wasn't exactly sure how it all worked and had considered borrowing a card with a U.S. chip. I didn't, and it wouldn't have mattered because here to find out it's not compatible anyways.

It continued to be a problem not having chip and pin. Try having a conversation with the guy at Harry Ramadan's fish and chips about chips and pins? Gets confusing. At one point in a French Supermarche in Paris we were refused goods because the merchant couldn't figure out the "old" swipe technology. This occurred several other times, and it became apparent that the situation was much worse then in previous years when I was barely even aware of the issue and you can really carry only so much cash before you scare yourself. Eventually it's going to reach a point where American credit cards are worthless, and unusable in the rest of the world. Unfortunately to my knowledge there isn't a work around, though one may be on it's way here. Not yet, as it's only in the U.K. now, unless you have friends in low places. Till then I'm going to go order some boots and dream about fish and chips and a place where I have an unlimited balance credit card to go shopping.

Re: Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: April 18th, 2010, 1:14 pm
by A Person
My bank has been issuing chip & pin credit cards for three years now, I requested a new chip card, even though my old swipe one hadn't expired because I travel. Very few retailers in North America use the chip part. in Europe it's the other way round, they've had them since 2003 and it is getting increasingly difficult to use a an old swipe card

The reason is that there was a huge government sponsered drive to switch. In 2005 the rules were chaged - prior to that if a fraudulent charge was made on a swipe card the bank was liable, after the change the retailer took the loss. Consequently many retailers refused to take the risk.

There was more incentive for Europe to switch since fraud rates were quite a bit higher there. Credit card transactions were offline (usually overnight), whereas they are usually online and immediate in the US, meaning that fraud could be spotted quicker.

Visa's help page glosses over the issue but I think some US banks can issue a 'travel credit card'

Europe plans to be fully converted in 2012, Canada in 2015 - the US may start the process by then and since it takes eight years ...

Re: Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: April 18th, 2010, 2:18 pm
by Liv
Well this is the first time I truly ran into issues. The UK seems to be much more forgiving than mainland Europe. I would be more than happy to pay a $20 or $30 yearly fee to have my bank card manufactured with both swipe and chip and pin for further travels.... so there's a niche for any credit card companies out there listening....

Re: Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: April 18th, 2010, 6:28 pm
by A Person
Mine has both...

You can get a US dollar credit card from most Canadian banks although their picture doesn't show the chip.

Image

Re: Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: April 18th, 2010, 7:26 pm
by Liv
Is it available to Americans? Im on mobile right now so i couldn`t tell. Also from talking around I was warned u.s. chip & pins won`t work over there. Yours does?

Re: Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: April 18th, 2010, 9:51 pm
by A Person
Is it available to Americans?

Hmmm apparently not
1. To be eligible, you must:
Be a Canadian resident.


They do have a brabch in the US, but the site doesn't mention chip technology


Also from talking around I was warned u.s. chip & pins won`t work over there. The US doesn't have chip and pin cards :) The US has some contactless 'wave' or 'tap and go' smart cards- you wave it near the reader and it charges your card without you having to sign or use a PIN. But acceptance has been slow and these 'smart cards' don't work in Europe. Maybe that's what your friends are talking about.

Yours does?
Yes

My card does all three, magnetic stripe, wave and chip and pin. I've never used the wave, it sounds a bit dubious to me. I like the idea of requiring something a bit more positive. But the other two methods work just fine everywhere I've tried it in the US, Canasa and UK

Re: Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: April 19th, 2010, 2:10 pm
by Liv
I assume the wave is RFID? I had a gas card with that for awhile... loved it. Some people are suggesting the U.S. will leap frog chip and pin straight to RFID? I just wish we didn't have to always be last with all this.

Re: Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: April 19th, 2010, 6:19 pm
by A Person
If your objective is to reduce fraud the wave card doesn't help much

The RFID encryption is good (I believe), but it only requires the card and there is no authentication as there is with the chip and pin or the signature . That's why they're limited to small purchases (<$50) so that hopefully you won't get stiffed with too many $49.99 purchases

The objective of the wave technology is to encourage people to use credit cards for small purchases. Most people don't use credit cards for small purchases because of the 'hassle' - vendors don't encourage it because of the costs of a credit card transaction and so Visa lose all that potential revenue

Re: Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: April 19th, 2010, 7:25 pm
by Liv
Well as soon as they make a chip and pin I will definitely get one. If I had the time I'd write a formal request to my bank asking for one, not that it would do anything... but ya know.....

Re: Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: July 4th, 2010, 11:25 am
by Liv
the first USA-based credit card issuer to offer its customers chip-and-PIN as well as swipe-and-sign payment options.

It’s probably no surprise that the credit union in question is one with a highly mobile and international user base: the United Nations Federal Credit Union, whose membership is limited to employees of the UN, a limited set of affiliated organizations, and family members of existing members. cite


Too bad it's not with a more open institution.

Re: Your American Money is worthless to them - Chip & Pin

PostPosted: August 6th, 2010, 2:30 pm
by Liv
Check this... got my student ID the other day... no magnetic strip... but a chip and pin for holding balances... My student ID is more modern than America's credit card industry.