Merry Christmas with a Vengeance.

[Liv]

Something feels lost with Christmas this year. Capitalism run amok, children getting two to three hundred dollar presents. It's gotten worse every year, but what really seems to be upsetting the masses is the fact people are awakening to discover Christmas has nothing to do with religion. What's more, is people are attempting to reclaim it, take it back with a vengeance. A few years ago, a retail attempt of turning Christmas into a more politically correct "Happy Holiday" back-fired on merchants. This year, it appears everyone I run into who follows the Christian faith demands it to be a "Merry Christmas". The "Holiday Tree" replaced by the in-your-face Crucfix Christmas Tree. Good tidings replaced with the wrath of God.

I knew it went from a normal "Merry Christmas" to a vendetta version of the same phase when individuals would say "Merry Christmas" to me, when I shopped, was walking, or picking up the kids from school, and then grabbed my shoulder as I nodded to acknowledge, turned me to face them and widened their eyes in such a way as to say "Merry Christmas You got it?" Yeah, yeah I got it, I think? As they demanded I say it back with their body language. "Merry Christmas" I'd say reluctantly. I don't mind saying it, even though I no longer Identify as 100% bonafide believer in religion anymore. At first I did try responding with "Happy Holidays" as I did with one gentleman who rebutted "And....?" "Merry Christmas, I replied?"

The climax of this phenomenon occurred at a public tree lighting in Randolph county I attended that had some public official demand we all pray. When not every one did, he demanded those praying to force those who weren't- to do it. As every one's head was down, Shannon looked over at me and whispered "We are coming, we are here." It would have been absolutely hilarious (creepy but hilarious) if it wasn't for I turned around and caught my daughter praying with them? "What? I don't even take you to church kid!!!!!!!"

I felt horrible for anyone who attended who may have been Jewish, Atheist or Muslim, and just wanted to participate in a public function, a winter festival with Christian traditions without being forced to convert.... geesh. I mean I can respect that the holiday may mean something else to you, but you shouldn't force me to celebrate my Christmas your way just because you can't handle the fact your holiday has nothing to do with the religion you purport it to. Give me friends and family and give me food, but don't give me some nutty Christian who thinks Christmas is only their holiday, and no one else can have it.... because if that's the case, the Pagans called and said they want it back.

[C. Alice]

Dear Boss Company, that is one weird and butt-ugly tree you're trying to sell.
It looks like someone with lousy taste and limited visual acuity took a woodshop class project, covered it with crazy glue and then dragged it through a dumpster full of fake Fir.


Liv, we want to hear more about the person demanding prayer- what was said to the crowd and who was the person doing so?

[BecauseHeLives]

if it wasn't for I turned around and caught my daughter praying with them? "

And a child shall lead them.

Perhaps your child prays more than you think and she's just afraid to let you know.

[Sanjuro]

if it wasn't for I turned around and caught my daughter praying with them? "

And a child shall lead them.

Perhaps your child prays more than you think and she's just afraid to let you know.

If you REALLY thought that, you greatly underestimate the desire for children to be accepted by adults in their community.

Its just as likely she's a kid and wants to people-please by mimicking what everyone else she sees is doing. I know that's what I did when people prayed around me at that age. Something didn't feel right about it, but I did it anyway because I didn't want to be singled out or chastised.

[Serendipitous]

I felt horrible for anyone who attended who may have been Jewish, Atheist or Muslim, and just wanted to participate in a public function, a winter festival with Christian traditions without being forced to convert.... geesh. I mean I can respect that the holiday may mean something else to you, but you shouldn't force me to celebrate my Christmas your way just because you can't handle the fact your holiday has nothing to do with the religion you purport it to. Give me friends and family and give me food, but don't give me some nutty Christian who thinks Christmas is only their holiday, and no one else can have it.... because if that's the case, the Pagans called and said they want it back.

One of my classmates from highschool ranted. He thinks he is expected to be tolerant of other people's beliefs by having a "holiday party" at work instead of the other people being tolerant of him and others like him who want to have the traditional party theme and call it a "christmas party." He asks, "why does the majority ALWAYS seem to have to bend for those few who can't adjust to anything but expect YOU to adjust to EVERYTHING for them?"

Everyone wants things his or her way. I don't see why it can't be a Winter Solstice party. I mean, isn't that the ONE THING that everyone should agree happens in December?

As for my friend, this still would not be good enough. He is hell-bent on it being called a christmas party because that's the traditional theme and it's as if he and others like him have staked claim on the party at work.

[SouthernFriedInfidel]

Yep -- you'll be "merry" the way WE want you to be, OR ELSE!

Peace on Earth. Goodwill to men. Christian men, specifically.

[Liv]

Liv, we want to hear more about the person demanding prayer- what was said to the crowd and who was the person doing so?

Basically the guy got up on the trailer took the mic and began a prayer session. Told everyone to bow their heads, and when not everyone did, he commanded everyone to look around at all the people without their heads down and ask them to lower their heads and pray with them.

[Liv]

Perhaps your child prays more than you think and she's just afraid to let you know.

Why should she be afraid, I never stopped her from it? In fact I stood beside her that night and pointed it out to Shannon, and we had a giggle. She's a sentient being free to decide for herself what she believes. I've never stopped her from exploring religion, but I don't lie when I present my opinion and beliefs in front of her.

[ecofox]

Perhaps your child prays more than you think and she's just afraid to let you know.

Why should she be afraid, I never stopped her from it? In fact I stood beside her that night and pointed it out to Shannon, and we had a giggle. She's a sentient being free to decide for herself what she believes. I've never stopped her from exploring religion, but I don't lie when I present my opinion and beliefs in front of her.

Your belief, There is no evil?

Also on the issue at hand.

Forcing people to pray is bad. It's like forcing someone to exercise and get healthy. Let them choose if they want to be unhealthy or if they want to be fit. It's their choice.

If God wanted to force everyone to pray to him he would have done it. Since he doesn't he must have a good reason for it.

Love? Free will?

[Liv]

Your belief, There is no evil?

I never said that was my belief. I asked, in another thread "Is there evil, or only people of differing opinion who both believe they're right".

But if you want my personal opinion.... I think all of the human race suffers from some level of insanity. Some more than others, and on the far end of the spectrum are individuals whom we can't label as "evil" because mentally, I'm not sure we can quantify it that way... but they do take on all the attributes of the modern definition of evil. The biggest misconception of our species is that because we all look similar on the outside, then we must all think alike on the inside... and it's just not true. Some do bad things because, indeed they believe they're right, and everyone else thinks it's wrong, others just because it's the only way they can see it, some because they can't help it, and yet still, others who just do it because they want to see what happens. Is that last of those evil? Or just someone whose brain is overly wired towards curiosity, and their pleasure receptors love to get fired off at the sight of a decapitated corpse shooting blood from it's neck?

[SouthernFriedInfidel]

Your belief, There is no evil?

I never said that was my belief.

Well now you've been told, so just remember it.

[Liv]

Well now you've been told, so just remember it.

I thought the same thing.

[ecofox]

Your belief, There is no evil?

I never said that was my belief. I asked, in another thread "Is there evil, or only people of differing opinion who both believe they're right".

Ok.

Good question.
I would rephrase it as this:
Does truth exist?
Who defines it?

But if you want my personal opinion.... I think all of the human race suffers from some level of insanity. Some more than others, and on the far end of the spectrum are individuals whom we can't label as "evil" because mentally, I'm not sure we can quantify it that way...

Well if we are all suffers from insanity I suppose we are never truly in our "right" mind.

Never accountable for our actions.

but they do take on all the attributes of the modern definition of evil. The biggest misconception of our species is that because we all look similar on the outside, then we must all think alike on the inside... and it's just not true.

Are you absolutely sure this is true?

Some do bad things because, indeed they believe they're right, and everyone else thinks it's wrong,

Who right?
Who defines "bad"?

If absolute evil exists doesn't that mean absolute truth exists?

others just because it's the only way they can see it, some because they can't help it, and yet still, others who just do it because they want to see what happens. Is that last of those evil? Or just someone whose brain is overly wired towards curiosity, and their pleasure receptors love to get fired off at the sight of a decapitated corpse shooting blood from it's neck?

Good question.
Do we have choices?

Or are we biological machines. Just sacks of jelly that move about every time someone takes a stab at it.

Are we accountable for our actions? To who?

---
I can understand.

Following illogical relativism to its logical conclusion leads you to believe that their is no evil.

However the darkness was too complete so you shied away from this conclusion.
When I hit this point I knew that this belief system was false.

However if it was true I was ready to abandon all morals.
For all they are is man made constructs.

Who's morals are better fit to rule my life then my own?
No light no darkness. It became meaningless.

Whether I help a child or let him die.

Truth does not exist. My actions are neither beneficial or harmful. Neither good nor bad. It's all relative.

In this darkness I saw a ray of light, I found that truth was absolute.

I began to seek the one who shined this light.
To abandon all other distractions and care for nothing but truth.

[Liv]

I began to seek the one who shined this light.
To abandon all other distractions and care for nothing but truth.

The truth? We're vessels for DNA some which have varying levels of awareness of their own existence.

There's your poetry for the day. Your welcome.

[ecofox]

I began to seek the one who shined this light.
To abandon all other distractions and care for nothing but truth.

Ok, that may be an exaggeration now that I think about it. I am very distracted but somehow by God's grace he guides me towards him.

The truth? We're vessels for DNA some which have varying levels of awareness of their own existence.

Are you absolutely sure this is true?

So there's no such thing as evil?

There's your poetry for the day. Your welcome.

It's quite heart breaking.
But Thank you.

I don't understand. I don't understand... Why! O Why would you choose a lie?

Don't you see? Is my logic not sound? Is not the whole universe testament to a great creator?